Finding Greatness with Baseball Coach Sean Travers

Chapter Overview:

0:15 Who is Sean Travers
0:34 What age group does Sean Travers train
0:54 What does Six Four Club specializes on
1:46 What’s interesting about the mental side of baseball
3:35 How does Sean Travers work with kids to build confidence
9:42 What brought Sean Travers to being a coach
12:51 What are the things that are holding a lot of kids back from reaching their potential
15:22 How does Sean Travers deal with athletes
18:02 What Sean Travers want to change in baseball
23:03 What does Dominate mean for Sean Travers
26:45 Other pointers from Sean Travers

Clance: Sean Travers! My man. One and only. Tell them who you are and what you do.

Sean: My name’s Sean Travers. I run the Six Four Club, which is a baseball instructional club that we work with middle infielders especially, although I also work with hitters and a little bit of pitching and stuff like that. Coached some teams, but my main focus is developing young baseball players.

Clance: And how old?

Sean: I mean, you know, probably 12, 13 is where we start. I do have some younger players that are 8 or 9, you know, and I will take those guys on if they have a special passion. I’m not, you know, 8 or 9 years old, I don’t really care how good of a player they are, but if they show a special passion for the game, I’ll work with anybody that has a passion for baseball.

Clance: Nice. So what is a Six Four’s specialty? I should say.

Sean: I mean, my specialty would be middle infield place. So shortstop, second basement, defense, you know, the big thing about is the middle infield has gotta be able to turn the whole play. So, you know, I really love working with million filters to get them. More agile, more athletic, smooth fluid, and just kinda maximize their God-given ability. So that’s kind of a passion, that’s kinda what I’m known for, but I’ve also, you know, I also enjoy working with hitters from 12 years old to professional hitters and had some success with those guys.

The thing about hitting that I love is once you get the physical stuff down, that’s when you can start kind of attacking the mental and developing the, the mental side of a hitter, which is very interesting to me.

Clance: What’s interesting about the mental side?

Sean: Let’s just it’s such a, you know, in sports you’re 60 feet and 6 inches away from this guy that’s throwing 95 miles an hour, right? So there’s a certain amount of courage that a hitter needs to have. I always say to people, I would much rather have a confident hitter with a bad swing, than a great swing with no confidence.

You know, you gotta have some swag when you go up there and you’re facing that guy throwing 90-95 miles an hour, and you get to have the confidence to stand in there, but you also have to have the confidence that you’re going to beat this guy. And so with baseball being such a failure sport, I mean, literally you fail 7 out of 10 times, you’re a superstar. It really works on the brain.

So you, you know, you can help players understand that there’s different levels of success. It’s just not always about getting a base hit. It’s with having quality of bats. It’s about, you know, instead of playing checkers, you’re kind of playing chess where you start to develop an approach as a hitter, and you look for certain pitches, and when you get that pitch, you don’t miss it. But, you know, we try to create kind of animals in the box, kind of really controlled aggression. So, you know, at first we really pay attention to the fundamental, teach the fundamental, then we let the athlete find it on his own. And then we really try to build the confidence.

Clance: I love that because I have a saying in the gym here: control fury. We use a lot control fury. So you just, you gotta be relaxed where you got to have control fury.

You say confidence a lot and going back to the gym for us, we rather have a guy with, you know, ultimate blend of you know, the most talented person. Talent is important, but give me a guy with a little bit of talent, you know, above average time, but willpower. That willpower to succeed, give me that person any day.

Now, when you find these kids now, because you’re a confident guy, knowing you for years, you’re a straight shooter. How do you work with the kids to help the ones who are lacking that confidence that you want and, two questions, have you built any?

Sean: I mean, I think that’s it. If you asked me what the best thing that I do for a young athlete is that and parents won’t always understand that because, you know, they want you to make their kid comfortable. And for me, comfortable is like the worst place to be. Comfortable, great, you can’t, you’ll never find-

Clance: Say that again, baby. Sorry. Say it again.

Sean: You can never find greatness in comfort. So I like to put the athletes in uncomfortable situations. That being said, I’m not asking to do anything that I don’t think that they can do, but to gain confidence, like I said, you know, when we were talking earlier, I talked about you can’t go with an athlete until they trust you totally.

Clance: Correct.

Sean: So I’ll spend as much time as I need to feel like that athlete trust me and then once they trust me, that’s when I’ll make them uncomfortable. But in that uncomfortable, we’re building up their confidence.

So, you know, I mean, I’m super proud of all the professional baseball players we have in the big league baseball players. That’s all great, but I’m just as proud as the, you know, of the 12 year old that comes in and when he first meets me, he looks down on the ground and shakes my hand, and he’s very nervous and shy. And then, you know, two years later, he kind of owns the gym and he’s walking around with his chest out, and he’s still not the greatest baseball player on earth, but you see that’s going to translate to the rest of his life. Like this guy is going to be able to take this to business where we first met him, you know, he couldn’t even really talk to another person.

We had an athlete this year that he’s one of the most special athletes that I’ve ever been around, 16 years old, 17 years old. And we got him 14 months ago. He’s from the reservation in Branford. So native. Very, very quiet. So when he came in, he was looking down, he couldn’t really talk, he never talked. It was just all one word answers at the most, and they threw the first ball and I was like, wow, like this is special.

And, we worked on the athletic ability, but at the time he didn’t even think he could play college baseball. And 12 months later, he signed a division one scholarship, and he’s getting ready to, you know, he’s going to go to one of the best schools in the country, and people say, wow, you guys did a great job at a baseball.

And my thing is, I think the best thing that we did was give this kid confidence and let him, as soon as he started believing in himself, then the world got to see the ability before that they didn’t, you know, and he’s just, he’s kind of on a different path now. And it’s unbelievable watching him, you know, now talk to his teammates and talk to coaches. To me that’s the big deal is we’ve given this guy confidence.

Clance: And that’s what I, you know, I think you hit the nail on the head. I know you hit the nail on the head because that’s what I’ve always been drawn to you or respect you and appreciate how you approach it because you have that, you love building up kids. I can see that. Just seeing you talking, just love building up that confidence. You have an approach that I think is the right approach. Step by step approach. And a lot of people from the outside mind, they see the toughness, they don’t see the fact that I think that one word is that you care. You literally care and you care so much that you’re going to tell them the truth.

Sean: Right. And it goes for me and like anybody I coach with, my biggest thing is I hate when people are not reaching their potential. And if it’s their fault, I can kind of live with it. You know, if you’ve got a kid that doesn’t really put in the work in the gym and he doesn’t work, put in the work on his skill work and he’s not reaching his potential. I mean, I’ll try and I’ll try, but at some point I just kind of be like, he’s gonna either figure it out, or he’s not gonna be that good. The kid that has potential. And he’s in a gym busting his butt every day, and he’s doing everything that I’m asking him to do skill-wise, and he’s not seeing the results, nothing frustrates me or my coaches more.

And I’ll literally, and I’m not talking about just the professional-level players, I’m talking about the, you know, decent high school players. It will keep me up at night trying to figure out why this guy is not having success. And it has nothing to do with, you know, us getting better. I just feel like every athlete that we work with, that’s putting in the work, that’s trusting us, I got to figure out a way to make them perform. And if I’m not doing it, I’m going to try 5, 6, 7, 8, 10 different ways. And as an instructor, as a coach, I think it’s really important not to have an ego.

Maybe if you’re not connecting with the player, you have to be able to turn them over to somebody else that maybe you can connect with them. You know, and that’s why having a great network of strong people is what you want. And if somebody comes to me and they’re weak, first thing I’m gonna do is say, here’s Clance’s number, call. Because I’m not a strength and conditioning expert. And I know what you should look like. I know you should be able to do. I don’t know how to get you there so here’s Clance’s number.

You know, same thing goes with the mental stuff. I’m not a doctor, and if there’s serious issues then we’ll say, look, you need to go see the sports psychologist and try to work through some of these things, because you know, there’s something about you that’s blocking you in your brain that I can’t get to. But as a coach, you have to be able to put your ego aside and say, hey, there might be somebody better at something than you.

Clance: That’s exactly how I approach it. Like, I’m sitting here listening to you, I feel like we’re twins. No, for real.

Sean: Maybe it’s the beard.

Clance: Maybe. I wish I can grow, but no, honestly, on a serious note, some people take that approach. Maybe like I’m a little too intense, that’s because I care.

Sean: A hundred percent.

Clance: Don’t be with me and not getting results, man. That drives me crazy. So I take it personal and I try to tell that our coaching staff that we have, if you step in these doors, you have to get better. It keeps me up at night on the real. And that’s why I have experts just like you in different avenues, who can help you where I fall short, and I have to put that ego aside.

Sean: Have to.

Clance: If I don’t, because it’s not about me, it’s about you. It’s not about me. It’s about you. It’s about the athlete. I love your approach, man. Why are you like, how… Tell us a little bit about Sean Tavarers coming up, playing back. Because I know you played basketball. I mean, sorry, baseball. Give me a little bit about your past and what brought you to here today?

Sean: So, I mean, I grew up in Mississauga, played three sports, played basketball, football, and baseball. Baseball, there was no high school baseball. That was obviously the sport that I was best at. But, when I was a decent basketball player and could have played college football as well.

Clance: What position you play in basketball?

Sean: Point guard.

Clance: Point guard. I was just teasing you.

Sean: I played point guard. I mean, I’m 6′ 1″, but like in football, I could have played college football, played quarterback, but baseball seemed like that was my best chance to be a pro. So at the time there was no real high school baseball. There still really isn’t, but there wasn’t really travel teams and stuff like that. So when I met some Scouts in the states, they’re like, well, what’s your high school? And I said, well, we don’t play high school baseball, and they were like.

So, at the time I, you know, I told my parents I’m gonna get a baseball scholarship and that, you know, nobody was doing that. For whatever reason my parents believed in me, they just say, you know, they relate. They didn’t ask a lot of questions. My mom was a, you know, a principal, so academics was everything, but I told her, look, I’m going to get a baseball scholarship and they just believed in it.

So I went from, you know, playing this whatever level in Ontario to being a scholarship athlete in California. And I got out there and I had a real successful first freshmen fall, I hit like 430, 440, like I had a huge, you know, offensive. And my defense was bad. The funny thing is when I went out there, the Scouts said that I was a great defender, couldn’t hit. So I got out there. I was kind of the opposite. I hit, I couldn’t defend, but that’s a whole different story.

Halfway through that fall, I was so lost because I didn’t, I’d never been in an environment like that. Growing up in Canada, I never played for a real coach. I never had real practices every day. I didn’t understand. I’d show up 15 minutes before practice and think I’m 15 minutes early. Everybody else showed up 45 minutes before me. So I was 45 minutes late and I never understood that. So very early in my first semester, I said to myself, if I ever get the chance, I’m going to go back home and prepare these kids for a coach. That’s hard on them for a coach that’s demanding, and get them ready for college.

Unfortunately at the semester I got my scholarship taken away because, and it really didn’t have anything to do on the field. It had to do with off the field. You know, I didn’t jive. I didn’t know how to, like I said, get to practice an hour early. So I was different than the other guys. So I had to come back home and kind of refigure things out. And then I got on the right path. But like, even before that happened, I said to myself, if I get a chance, I’m going to come back and teach these kids what it takes to be a college athlete. And that’s when my playing career was over, that’s what I started doing. And it’s been a passion ever since.

Clance: It’s a passion ever since. I can, I can. So right now, like what do you think is the biggest thing or multiple things that are holding a lot of kids back from reaching their potential?

Sean: I mean, probably the number one thing is they’re not real. They’re not real with themselves. So, you know, everybody says they want to hear the truth, but in my experience, they don’t want to hear the truth. They want you to kind of reaffirm what they think. So if we have the truth, we can attack it and we can make it better.

So for instance, in baseball, one of the things that they scale you on is your running speed. So one of the tools that we’ll use to grade your running speed is a 60-yard dash. So the kid will run a 60 and to be, you know, a position where speed is important. It needs to be just easy. It needs to be under 7. So 7 is average. Under 7 is good. 6-5 is great. 7-2 is alright. 7-5 is horrible and I’ll meet a player and he’ll play centerfield. So obviously he needs to be able to run.

I’ll say, what’s your 60 time and you’ll say 6 to 8. I’ll be like, oh, great, then we’ll get them out on the field at 7-5. And so they’re not being real, you know what I mean? And I’m not saying they’re lying. Like, you know, maybe their dad was holding a stopwatch and, oh, we got a 6, 8. Great. And they’re celebrating this thing when really, if they say, look, I’m a 7-5 runner. I want to be a centerfielder, I’m not big enough to hit the ball up. So I’m a speed guy. I’m based on speed. At the last level, I’m the fastest kid on the field because I’m playing with regular kids.

Now I’m playing against the best in the world. I need to be a 6-8 runner. Well, then I can get them with you and say, Clance I need this kid. I need some strength. I need some strength because he’s not finishing. His first 20 yards is great, but then he runs out of endurance. He loses form because not enough core strength, I can say, look is running forms not good. Get with Clance, he’ll teach you running form. And then they can work with you. And then 6 months later, they’re running the 6-8 that they should have been running.

But if they’re lying to themselves and say, oh, I run a 8, I run a 6-8. They’re never going to put in the work with you. They’re never going to, you know, and it’s just gonna always be a problem instead of fixing the problem. So I’m really big, I think a lot of people, you know, kind of fixate on the problem. I fixed it on the solution. There’s always a solution to everything. I’m not saying you can take a 7-5 runner and make them a world-class run, but we can get them to a point where it’s not taking away from his game type thing if they’re honest, but if they’re not honest, there’s not, you know, there’s not much we can do if they don’t realize what the issue is.

Clance: How do you deal with, you know, in terms of the relationships with like, you have some of these gifted athletes and, but, you know, they can be doing better or way better, or maybe you think they’re horrible, but they’re gifted athlete, but they’re horrible baseball player. What comes into play is normally what a lot of praise and a lot of everybody’s sugar-coated and everything for them, and oh, you’re the greatest and so-and-so, but when they meet a real straight shooter, like you, who tells them what it is, how do you do situations like that? How do you deal with it?

Like I said, I mean, you know, my first thing is to win over the player, and if after trying, I don’t win over the player. I know it’s really not going to go anywhere just from past history. There’s, I try to think about like a player in my coaching career that left me to go somewhere else or do something different because of how we felt about a situation and that they did really well. And then I looked back and said, oh, you know, I’m going to mess this up. And I honestly, there’s not one time that happened where somebody start differently than me, a kid start differently, they went in and took their path and it worked out better than, you know what I mean?

And so when I look at that, I mean, it’s easy for me to kind of let go, because what I actually, when I’m letting go of a player and say, look, go somewhere else. What I’m hoping happens is he goes, somewhere else, finds out that’s not it, and then he can come back to me and at times not. And we haven’t wasted too much time because I can’t work with an athlete under his or his parent’s terms. I just, it’s not interesting to me, you know, you can’t, I mean, like a saying to me is like, you can create a decent athlete with some attaboys and some pats on the back, but it’s going to take some motherhood to make it-

Clance: Say it!

Sean: You know, and if that’s a problem then unfortunately that’s gonna be a problem for your, for your son. It might get your son, the rest of his life. You know, like a boss, you know, if a boss isn’t hard on you, you never going to get the best out of you. And you have to learn how to build, to deal with the boss being hard on you.

When a boss is being hard on you, it’s not because he dislikes you. It’s because you’re underachieving, he’s trying to get you to do better. And kids don’t understand that necessarily when a coach is yelling at them, they think he doesn’t like them. Nah, when I’m time and I’m going at you, it’s because I like you it’s because I’ll never, I’m not a bully. I don’t go after players who can’t do something. I’m only going to go after you if I think you’re underachieving not reaching the potential that you should be at.

Clance: I love it, man. If you had a magic wand and you could make one wish and that one wish is to change something in baseball, what would it be?

Sean: Ah, that’s easiest question ever, money. I wish baseball didn’t cost so much money to develop players, you know. Back in the day, and I don’t know exactly who said it might’ve been Joe DiMaggio, something like that, he said, “look, baseball is not for rich kids. If you’re rich, you have no chance to play baseball because it’s such a grind and it’s so hard. It’s kind of like boxing, you know, there’s no such thing as a rich boxer, you know, boxers can kind of come up out of the mud.

That was baseball players back in the day, the game had switched. So in north America, it’s very expensive to play baseball. So, you know, you look at African-Americans and they say, “oh, there’s no, African-Americans, aren’t playing baseball anymore ’cause it’s boring.

They don’t like the sport, that has nothing to do with it. They’re not playing because it’s too expensive. So inner city kids cannot afford to play baseball. Whereas if they’re playing basketball, the travel basketball teams are paying for them. If they’re playing football at a big school, a big high school, everything, they’re superstar.

Baseball is not like that. No matter where you play, you have to pay. And that’s, you know, in the inner city schools, baseball programs aren’t so you’re not getting the coaching. So you have to get some kind of instruction. So there’s the RBI clinics that major league baseball puts on and you know, it looks good, but to me, it’s not, it needs more where’s your production, right? So to me, the reason why these kids are going and playing these other sports, it’s too expensive to play baseball.

You know, in the states, even for summer travel, it’s $2,500 for that program. I mean, that’s so you see you’re in the inner city, it’s going to be $2,500 a play baseball, or we’re going to pay for everything to go play basketball. Well, what are you going to do? So we have all these 6′ 2″ great athletes that are not going to be pros in basketball because they’re playing, you know, power forward. And they’re 6′ 2″, 6′ 3” when these guys could be major league baseball players. So for me, the easy answer is a magic wand, how do we fix baseball it’s not so expensive, but I just don’t know how you do that. Proof of what I’m saying is the Dominican Republic, those kids in Dominican are playing for a whole different reason than north Americans are paying for it.

Well, they’re playing to eat. So the funny thing is like some of those kids don’t even really like baseball. They’re just playing it because that’s how they’re going to feed their families ’cause they’re good at it. So I think if you look at the stats and I don’t know if that’s exactly, and I’m kind of going off the top of my head, but you know, you have, Dominican’s assigned for a million dollars and you have Dominican’s assigned for $10,000. And so there should be way more Dominican’s assigned for a million dollars, make the major leagues. Then once assigned for $10,000, right? Because the ones assigned for a million and the ones with the talent. But I think if you looked at it the weight is way off, like there’s a lot of big signing, big guys, guys assigned for a lot of money that never make it, and there’s a lot of guys for $10,000, they make it.

They ask me why, well, when you have $2 million, you now your family set. So you’re not, you know, all that work you did to set up your family. They’re set now. They take a break and it’s, they don’t really love the game like that. Whereas these guys playing for $10,000, they’re still everyday trying to feed their family. So they’re grinding. And they’re putting in that extra effort where it’s tough for a person from means to do that. You know, it’s very easy to say, ah, that’s a little hard, I’m not gonna do that.

Clance: Different motivation. Compete.

Sean: Right. So, so that’s the big thing I wish money could be out of it. I wish in my programs, I didn’t have to charge a dollar. I wish I could. I wish I was totally funded where I could go pick the athletes and develop them, but unfortunately it cost a lot of money to travel, especially in Canada, you know, we have to spend a lot of time in the states. You’ve got bus charges, we’ve got hotel charges, we got cold. Like it’s all very expensive. But I think if you had a properly funded program where money, wasn’t an issue, wow, we can have some special kids.

Clance: I feel you, man. Cause that’s why we’re building a foundation so we can help identify and help those athletes that who had that talent. But don’t have the means because we see it all the time.

Sean: So we did that last year. So Cito Gaston is kind of a mentor for me, a family friend, and so we went to Cito and said, look, we want to start a scholarship in your name. And Cito is, you know, Cito is one of the classiest men you’ll ever, ever meet. And he kind of understands this about baseball being expensive. And so we went to him and said, look, we want to start a scholarship for, you know, African-Canadian kids that can’t afford to pay the full fees and see, it was 100% behind it.

In our first year we actually, you know, we raised substantially more money than I thought. I think the first year we made about $20,000. So we had five athletes that were able to benefit from that and hopefully that just keeps growing and growing and we can do something different and kind of have the model in Canada for the US, which is kind of weird, right? But we started here and hopefully that kind of, you know, that I talked to some of my peers in the US and say, look, implement this scholarship in your program. So some of these kids that couldn’t do travel baseball can now do it.

Clance: Love that man. Fantastic. My man, last question. Since we were on Dominate Discussions, I always like to end off with, what does dominate, what does that word dominate mean to you?

Sean: I mean, I think it’s a mentality, first of all, right? So dominate everything that you do. The thing that I really try to get to my kids is mediocrity is so easy and we live in a society in Canada where mediocrity is, immediate mediocre. It Is easy, really easy to make $40,000 a year and, you know, and live a very mediocre life.

And if you’re mediocre in school, if you’re mediocre and then you’re going to be mediocre everywhere. So dominance to me is dominate everything, you know, dominate school, dominate the gym, dominate your sport, and you can go all for four in a baseball game and dominate. And you do that because you prepared, because you’re focused during the game, you put in your best effort. Some days you just get beat. That doesn’t mean you didn’t dominate.

You know, if you do that more, more times than not, if you prepare and you have confidence, you’re going to, you’re going to win more times than you lose. The thing is if people are very mediocre. So in baseball, you have five at bats, you get a hit and you’re in your first at bat, you get a hit. And you’re second at bat, you’re two for two. It’s very easy to throw those three at battling. Cause at the end of the game, you go through two for five, you got a great game, right? If you dominate, you’re never satisfied. You never give away in a bat. If your team’s up 10, nothing, you’re still, it’s like zero, zero, because you don’t know who’s watching you.

And for me, as soon as you stop competing, and as soon as you’re able to, oh, well, I threw away this a bat through. It becomes really easy to throw away at bats. You know, I tell my guys when I’m on the driveway playing my 12-year old daughter in basketball and she puts up lay up, I’m going to swat it on his own. Why are you doing that to that little girl? Because I want her to know this life that it’s not easy, you know?

And I want her when she scores a basket that she’s proud of it. I don’t want to just give her stuff. So, you know, I think competing is everywhere. If you’re not competing is going to be real tough for you to compete in the sport. So I think, you know, dominating is trying to dominate every aspect and just not being mediocre.

You know, if 14, if you know, 15% body fat is mediocre, then you’re not settling for that. You’re going to have 9% body fat or 8% body fat. If one or two pops a week is cool and you’re like, no, I’m dominating. I’m zero pop, and, and that’s what I try to build the athletes is animals on the field. Perfect gentlemen off the field, but on the field they’re animals.

One thing I say to my athletes all the time, like I’m not talking about off the field now. I want gentlemen off the field, great kids, all that stuff, but on the field, if I watch you play, and when I’m watching you play, I say, man, I’d love for you to date my daughter. I can’t say anything worse to you because on the field, there should be no nice guys. I’m not talking about about going outside the rules. I’m not talking about being dirty. I’m talking about competing until it’s over. And then when it’s over, it’s done. But if you’re competing against your best friend, I mean, you’re going to go hard. It’s going to, you’re going to do whatever it takes when the game is over, then you can go have dinner, but-

I’m sorry, but the best athletes I’ve trained have that switch. Beautiful, beautiful gentlemen, outside the gym. But once they’re in this bad boy, right. And after they finished their warmup, that switch goes on, talking is over, right. They just got that nasty and it just applies on the ice, on the field, wherever they’re out on the court. It’s so important, man. This is beautiful conversation, sir.

Is there anything that you want to talk about or you want to address that we might’ve missed out or left out?

Sean: I mean, I just, like I said, you know, my network is, I’ve had some incredible mentors, you know, got to play for some great coaches. And I think I’m a combination of kind of all of them, but you know, since when I started coaching, I started developing a network of really good people that I trust, obviously, you being one of them. And I really appreciate that network. You know, I appreciate that if I have somebody that needs to get stronger, I don’t have to worry about that. I can say, go see Clance. And if they go see you, I know everything that I need to get taken care of is going to get taken care of. And we can talk and you can be like, Sean, what specifically? What is this getting me? Well, we need to put on 15 lbs of muscle and we need to take a 60 from, you know, seven, five to six nine.

And then you’re focused and you get it done. I don’t have to keep up with, you know, don’t, I’m just beyond it because I know what’s going to happen, and I have that in every source, like for me as a baseball instructor, you know, I know a little about all the pieces, but if you have a son and you come to me and say, hey, my son’s a catcher, will you work with them? No, I’m going to send you our catching instructor. And he’s going to take care of you. So the network of coaches that have put, you know, that I have now, that’s what I probably appreciate the most. All like-minded people that are, you know, that want the best for the kids.

Number one, everybody has a little different way of doing it and I appreciate that. I mean, I think the world would be kind of boring if everybody was the same.

Clance: A Hundred percent.

Sean: And also maybe I don’t connect with a player. So I send them to a coach who maybe is more about getting a player comfortable, and then we can get them comfortable. Then maybe he’s ready to come back to me. But like, you know the guys in the circle, they’re different than everybody’s not the same. And I think that’s beautiful too, but I think the biggest thing is, like I said, the network of people that I’ve come across and are in my close network. I super appreciate that.

Clance: Love that. Beautiful conversation, baby. Beautiful. We could talk for days, man. We can talk for days.

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